Antonia Murphy has one of the wildest US/NZ stories I’ve heard yet. The San Francisco native founded and ran The Bach, a self-consciously ethical brothel in the small North Island city of Whangārei. (This is 100 percent legal in New Zealand!) Her memoir of those years, Madam, is an admirably frank depiction of sex work as work—joyful and frustrating, honorable and complicated—and it’s now an international television show starring Rachel Griffiths. Antonia and I had a great conversation about all of it, including the office dynamics of sex work, US vs NZ entrepreneurship, and her lingering “dark feelings” about her time in the industry. Hope you enjoy!
Lots of ways to listen and watch: Substack | Spotify | Apple Podcasts | YouTube
And welcome to the american.nz podcast! I’ve been writing these letters for a year or so, and now I’m hungry to talk to all kinds of folks. More episodes to come (and more letters, too.) Holler anytime at dan@american.nz.
Show notes:
01:40 | Why do Kiwis have more sex? Or do they?
03:06 | Founded by Puritans, but fascinated by “boobies and bottoms.”
07:30 | Decriminalized, but still stigmatized.
10:25 | “Our legal name was Tui Auto.”
11:30 | The abusive American client—and why he’s not American in the book
16:40 | “The vast majority are just normal guys.”
19:30 | Expat privilege, Kiwi values, and the American Dream
20:45 | Americans as “temporarily strapped billionaires”
24:50 | Professional boundaries in Brothel HR
29:30 | “Is what you did in Whangārei a net benefit to the people in the community?”
32:30 | Dark feelings. Practical Thoughts.
37:30 | Staying in New Zealand, isolation and all.
The study we discussed is here: Average Number of Sexual Partners by Country 2025. The theme music is “Winds in the Wellington Trees” by Anton Hughes. I shot the intro outside Greytown, with no wind at all.
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